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why kill off sound fellowship-- - 7/27/2010 6:03:49 PM
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Doctrinor
Posts: 144
Joined: 4/12/2005
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IF you took say 3 decades to 4 backwards in past times and looked at how fellowship was done IF doctrinally [and sound enough]/ And I point out that past times had the bad as well so that leaves no need to argue that/You took say sometime in the 60 or 1970s into the 80s and there were many solid good churchres to choose from [christian] WHY don't the churches of today try imitating such churches instead of inventing things that might possibly bring utter worldliness in the churches ..Adopting worldly culture is not the agape love of God i'd stress biblically..I feel there were excellent and good enough fellowship ways and patterns in past times that should not be left to die .People got saved there as well and they we're not dead places.Some feel to sort of throw out sound teachings that are in scriptures and I do not understand why though yes people choose by free will.Or they do it by ignoring what God has said and replace it with their ideas.
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RE: why kill off sound fellowship-- - 7/27/2010 7:17:54 PM
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navyblueret
Posts: 799
Joined: 11/29/2008
From: S/W Nebraska
Status: offline
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Shalom, Doctrinor.
In the 1960's and 70's, (exclude the 80's) many of the ministers were of the 1940's school of thought, with some semblance of the old Fellowship ways, still in residence at the pulpit. There was an overlap, however between the attitude at the pulpit, and the training of the new ministers, who would start doing 'their thing,' in the late 70's and continuing to get worse, until late 90's or early 2,000's.
In the later 60's I believe I saw the start, but the liberalizing of the Church was not the first target. The first target, was the students who would be in positions of power by the latter 70's, and on (some folk called them Yuppies). They followed that few years of complete rebellion of the old ways, by the Hippies. The Yuppies began taking responsibility for their own future, but had little to work with, from the Liberalized teachers, they had received education from, and the acceptance of 'In you Face, disrespect' the Hippies had placed before them. The old way had a burned bridge between the Yuppies, and any return to the old reliable, and safe ways, which had also taken a beating from WW-ll and Korean wars. (in complete, but you may get the idea)
The new, Head Ministers, of the late 70's and into the 80's had been taught to do the least necessary to accomplish a pay-day, and everything began going down hill quite rapidly, into the State of Laodiceanism church-goers. The less that was required by the congregation, the less the pulpit needed to feed them, so long as the money came in to pay the income, and overhead,,in that order.
Breaker, Breaker, time out for an up-date::: By now many are royally upset with me, so let me say::: Not all, actually only just enough started the slide, to erode, more and more rapidly Christianity. As the older pastors retired, from age, or frustration, the Willy-nilly crew of ministers just kept getting larger, and more in control. Today, as always many of our ministers, are fine, God Fearing, and Bible teaching, Servants of God. Tickling the ear became the way to have Mega-Congregation, and the good ministers began to find their Congregation dwindling to a point of bankruptcy. nuff said.
Today, IMO (as is every word I have spoken/typed), there is a resurrection of Shepherd type Ministers, and Memberships, trying to revive/resurrect the older Church, of Praise, Fellowship, and Social togetherness, only found by studying God's word, and living it as best one can, considering the pressures, and programs that are now trying to bury the Church, dead, or not, but losing the battle as more and more is needed from the Congregation, and the Congregation, wanting to be tickled, more and more. (To say nothing about that Cult that is trying to physically kill every Jew and Christian).
I could probably rant on for a page or three, but feel I have offered more than you probably wanted to hear/see.
I will close with: As I see it, God knew just what was going to happen and has formulated all the necessary contingency plans, that His Will will be Done, to His Glory, in these last of the last days, before He shuts the Gate, and brings forth Seven years of Tribulation, the likes of which the world has never seen nor will ever see again,,,,,because,,,,WE WIN, AND THE BAD DUDES LOOSE!! Yeee-Haaa!!! and AMEN, Millennium is just around the bend in the time road.
In Messiah, I serve, and Watch. Arley
_____________________________
In the name of 'THE' Mashiach, Man the wall, set the watch, sound the Shofar. Our redemption draws nigh.
Messiah, my Captain, and Helmsman.
(Joh 14:6 KJV) ... I am the way, the truth, and the life: ...
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RE: why kill off sound fellowship-- - 7/27/2010 7:26:41 PM
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benzapped
Posts: 201
Joined: 1/29/2010
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Doctrinor,
Your question (and comments) are somewhat complex. So for the sake of the thread I will comment on specifically this:
“…sometime in the 60 or 1970s into the 80s and there were many solid good churchres to choose from…I feel there were excellent and good enough fellowship ways and patterns in past times that should not be left to die…”
I was married and had small children in the 60’s, and vividly recall issues in “the churches” not much different than the issues we have today. My observation is that warm Christian fellowship is directly associated with (1) devout believers and (2) small groups.
It seems that 100% of the time the doors are “swung open” to include anyone who wants to join, that is when fellowship turns worldly because that is when the worldly come in. The worldly see organized churches as service providers—they want to consume, not become part of the body in praise, service, and edification. They are not Christian. They pollute and devise programs to attract more non-believers to further pollute. And what is sad, the typical (misdirected) church caters to this. It caters to numbers of pew-sitters and numbers on the financial sheet. It thinks worldly when it measures so-called success. Teaching and preaching is non-confrontational to accommodate the worldly...and the numbers.
That said, there are, and have always been, gatherings of the called out ones you long for. But they will be smaller in numbers plus highly discerning on who they extend fellowship to—they may even require a time of examination and membership class. They don’t put up billboards or run TV ads. You will have to search them out.
That is my opinion,
Ben
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RE: why kill off sound fellowship-- - 8/20/2010 8:16:53 AM
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Doctrinor
Posts: 144
Joined: 4/12/2005
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Navy --- very good way to share and respond and the big thrust you posted I agree [and with benzapped as well] ..navy it is sad and I see all of this too/Now a few christians [??] are putting much pressure on me to attend their mega-church when I was trying to leave [they say they love me but they will not allow me to grab or express any biblical beliefs from scriptures]..It seems they think I'm missing out from their pastor which gives pre-written printed fill-in-blank messages. I do like it when the bible is taught thru chapter and book in an order..Rick Warrenism is the latest hit there .I know some think how can that be bad.Under the situation and for long years I'm used to keeping a sort of low-profile and really 'try' to sek and trust God in all this..Ones are wrong claiming I lack faithfulness which I'm only lacking that in the eyes of men .Keep in touch both of you and PM as you like to me . Thanks but hopefully this thread will continue as needed..
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RE: why kill off sound fellowship-- - 8/20/2010 11:45:22 AM
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navyblueret
Posts: 799
Joined: 11/29/2008
From: S/W Nebraska
Status: offline
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Doctriner, Shalom.
(IMO) As for the Mega-church, your friends want you to knuckle under to:
R U N ! !(IMO)
Attending an E-Free Church, When Rick Warren's book came out, people began reading, and praising his words; so our Pastor shifted our Sunday School subject matter, 'Searching,' to The Purpose Driven Life; and we critically/Biblically studied the book, as a group. Gomer Pile could not have said it better, when he uttered those famous TV words: "Surprise, Surprise !!"
Our consensus of the over-all teaching in Mr Warren's book was also something like a very famous line, in Judaism, and Christianity: "Shurrrllly, you willl not Dieee, if you scarf (partake) on the fruit, of the knowledge of Good, and EEEEEvil,,,,'He' only wants you to stay dumb, and not know the truth of all things....etc"" (extreme paraphrase emphasis, mine).  In short, very accurate looking, with nuance twisting from truth to half-truth. The verdict was almost Unanimous (See the above: 'Run' word).
Fellowship is fantastic, IF, one is fellowshipping on the narrow path, and not in the middle of the Freeway (wrong-way at that). With the 'Falling-Away' seemingly in the process of 'Falling,' Good Fellow-shipper's may be a bit more difficult to find (Bible Studying types), as most seem to feel they are too busy, in their Freeway pursuits, to do their own study, so rely on the Wolves, who cry for discipleship of their word, not God's Word, plus all the money they can rake in, as if that money could ever stand up to the Tribulation, and Judgment, coming sooner than they believe.
I hadn't intended to Rant my feelings so long, but I pray you all understand my meaning: ,,,,FOCUS,,,, on Jesus, ONLY, lest one 'Fall Away,' on purpose, or by being willingly drug by supposed friends. Nuff Said.
In Messiah, My Focus. Arley (Keeping the Watch)  (Blink of an eye in middle)
_____________________________
In the name of 'THE' Mashiach, Man the wall, set the watch, sound the Shofar. Our redemption draws nigh.
Messiah, my Captain, and Helmsman.
(Joh 14:6 KJV) ... I am the way, the truth, and the life: ...
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